Devious Dr Sarfati

Creationist bloggers can be infuriating. If one has infuriated you by persisting in nonsense even when corrected, or refusing to reply to your criiticsm, you may feel driven to recording the fact. If so, you may register your disapproval here and hope a response is forthcoming.

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Re: Devious Dr Sarfati

Postby a_haworthroberts » Mon Sep 30, 2013 9:37 pm

The book reviewer named Stickler (in the US) has flagged this website, which I will take a closer look at in due course.
http://www.greatesthoaxonearth.blogspot ... chive.html
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Re: Devious Dr Sarfati

Postby a_haworthroberts » Thu Oct 03, 2013 3:10 am

Have now taken a closer look at the various pages.

Some comments on some of the individual posts:

http://www.greatesthoaxonearth.blogspot ... earth.html
I have - as far as I can tell - just managed to add the following comment under this review page:
"Washington
I am halfway through reading your interesting blog posts, after Stickler mentioned them at Amazon.com where both of us (and others) have reviewed - or 'reviewed' - Sarfati's book. I have flagged the blogs here - and will add another comment once I've gone through your posts:
viewtopic.php?f=18&t=2762&start=105
Have you thought of sending the link to this page to Creation Ministries International - in order to see whether Sarfati attempts to refute your refutation of his claimed refutation?
Ashley Haworth-Roberts"

http://www.greatesthoaxonearth.blogspot ... chive.html
The last para here is well worth reading (it makes sense even if you don't read the preceding text).

Washington's posts are well researched. I think more may follow.
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Re: Devious Dr Sarfati

Postby a_haworthroberts » Sun Oct 06, 2013 4:18 am

E mail as sent:


YEC Cowboy Bob Sorensen - admirer of YEC Jonathan Sarfati

Bob and Jonathan both love the word 'atheopath'.

http://www.piltdownsuperman.com/2013/10 ... ne-of.html
Today (US time) Bob is flagging this - I've not listened to the radio
programme, just read the comments.
http://www.lineoffireradio.com/2013/10/ ... nt-page-1/
(72 comments so far.)

So were some evolutionists and atheopaths refuted and hopelessly
outsmarted by chess champion Sarfati in the exchange of comments - as
Bob claims?

Well, I think the treatment of Greg Allen on the thread by several
other participants including Dr Sarfati - Greg apparently being a
Christian who accepts evolution - was pretty unpleasant. Whether anyone
actually 'refuted' him is not very apparent without studying the
exchanges in more depth.

As for the 'atheopath', I assume Sorensen has in mind Van. So far at
least, Dr Sarfati has most certainly NOT refuted or outsmarted Van.
Rather he has ignored him or her. (Nicholas Petersen has challenged
part of Van's most recent comment.)

Please be aware that a previous time when Dr Michael Brown interviewed
Dr Sarfati the latter then apparently RAN AWAY from the comments under
the article leaving questions and comments unanswered. See from around
comment 44 onwards (and especially from 54).
http://www.lineoffireradio.com/2011/08/ ... nt-page-2/
This departure by Dr Sarfati was after he accused me at post 54 of
being 'not very scientific' (yet, after commenting there on earlier
reviews of his book, he shunned my 2010 scientific review of 'The
Greatest Hoax on Earth? Refuting Dawkins on Evolution' at Amazon.com,
despite prompts sent to CMI).

By the way, last night I emailed Bob and also Tas Walker as follows
(and Bob had NO answer to make):
"'YEC claims about Tamu Massif volcano'
My post HERE at 10.40 pm BST on 04.10.13:
viewtopic.php?f=18&t=3153&start=480
Just noticed the name Tamu (as in Massif) chimes with 'Texas A & M
University' :)".

Followers of Dr Sarfati may also wish to see here (there's a new
online blog about his 2010 book):
viewtopic.php?f=18&t=2762&start=105

I'm grateful that Bob flagged the latest discussion as otherwise I
doubt I would have heard about it.
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Re: Devious Dr Sarfati

Postby a_haworthroberts » Sun Oct 06, 2013 8:56 am

Further email:

"Correction - Dr Sarfati DID write early on "Van rehashes the same
boring old atheopathic canards refuted in Galileo Quadricentennial:
Myth vs fact and he flat earth myth. Note that the leading flat-earther
is one of his fellow evolutionists!".

Glancing at the links, Sarfati did NOT refute the comment: "the
notions that the Earth is flat, never moves and is orbited by the sun
are much more obvious in the Bible". He just posted a link saying that
the medieval church did not teach that Earth was flat. The CMI article
flagged scarcely examined any Bible verses".
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Re: Devious Dr Sarfati

Postby a_haworthroberts » Mon Oct 07, 2013 7:25 pm

The conversation has resumed under the link to the new Sarfati radio interview. So I've added a comment. Except that - for reasons unknown - it 'awaits moderation'.

It reads as follows:
"I will listen to the Sarfati-Brown conversation shortly. Meanwhile Van may wish to see what happened during comments a couple of years ago:
http://www.lineoffireradio.com/2011/08/ ... nt-page-2/

Whenever a young Earth creationist states that they love ‘science’ they either do not know what they are talking about (because what they are loving is pseudo-science) or else, if the person presents themselves as an expert, they have secretly REDEFINED the word science and they really mean viewing reality thorough ‘biblical glasses’ (as the CMI is today advocating when highlighting an article about supposedly ‘young’ polar ice sheets).

Ashley"
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Re: Devious Dr Sarfati and suspicious delay by Dr Brown

Postby a_haworthroberts » Mon Oct 07, 2013 11:56 pm

Several hours on, all FOUR of my attempted posts at the 2013 and 2011 Line of Fire threads STILL await moderation by Dr Michael Brown. I would like to know WHY there is this delay and I have sent him a reminder. OTHER PEOPLE'S POSTS ARE STIll APPEARING AT THE 2013 THREAD - AHEAD OF MINE. IS BROWN YET ANOTHER DISHONEST YEC? HE ALLOWED ME TO POST IN 2011. HAS HE BEEN 'GOT AT' BY SARFATI OR SORENSEN? AM I BEING 'BLACKLISTED'? MANY ONLINE YECS EITHER CENSOR TRUTHFUL COMMENTS FROM OPPONENTS OR ELSE TRY TO DEPICT THE OPPONENTS AS LIARS. THEIR MOTIVE? IF PEOPLE BELIEVE WHAT I WRITE THEY MIGHT THINK TWICE ABOUT EMBRACING CHRISTIANITY OR - IN PARTICULAR - YEC-ISM! THUS TRUTHFUL COMMENTS MUST EITHER BE HIDDEN OR ATTACKED. (IF I DID LIE THEY WOULD PUBLISH AND REFUTE.)

The three other posts read as follows:

2013:
"I note that Dr Sarfati has not refuted the comment by Van: “the notions that the Earth is flat, never moves and is orbited by the sun are much more obvious in the Bible”. He just posted a link saying that the early and medieval church did not teach that Earth was flat. The CMI article flagged scarcely examined any Bible VERSES (and Isaiah 40:22 does not rule out Earth being a flat circular disc).
You would never guess that Sarfati did not refute this from reading THIS blogger:
http://www.piltdownsuperman.com/2013/10 ... ne-of.html".

2011:
"John [the YEC John Heininger]
We meet again. There’s NO convincing scientific evidence for a 6,000 year old Earth and universe. Thus there is no need to ‘prove’ that the date is wrong – or ‘prove’ c 4.5 bn years for the Earth.
We all know that, without the gymnastics performed by some pro-science Christians, Bible-derived timescales for the Earth and universe are guesswork and are totally wrong. Some Christians can live with that and still be Christians.
“Why even go down this mainstream science highway…”. Because science is about discovering new truths. Which is something all young Earth creationists HATE (unless perchance the truths happen to ‘confirm’ scripture in some way).
Sarfati has done a new interview with Brown during the past week. Hopefully you can find the link – if I post it I suspect this post will have to ‘await moderation’.
Ashley".

"Oh. I see I’m ‘awaiting moderation’ REGARDLESS. Here is the link:
http://www.lineoffireradio.com/2013/10/ ... nt-page-1/
I’ve also just attempted a comment there".

Should Brown, of whom I have previously formed a reasonably favourable impression, be unwise enough to silently censor me I WILL expose this both HERE and by wide-circulation EMAIL.
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Re: Dr Michael Brown

Postby a_haworthroberts » Tue Oct 08, 2013 12:05 am

I have just sent a reminder message to Brown. Unfortunately my effing computer has lost just it for me. I flagged my last two posts in this thread.
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Re: FOOTDRAGGING Dr Brown

Postby a_haworthroberts » Tue Oct 08, 2013 1:22 am

Another attempted comment at the 2013 thread, in response to one Nicholas Petersen. And you have guessed it - it 'awaits moderation'.


"Nicholas

The Himalaya, 'young' by Earth standards, are still growing (as well as eroding):
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-17191400

The marine fossil bearing layers might extend quite deep if they rose up from below by subduction and orogeny - rather than that the fossils somehow arrived there via a colossal flood (despite Everest being nowhere near the coast either now or 4,300 years' ago).

I also found THIS (which I've just noticed that you are referring to in your latest comment):
http://creationontrial.com/articles/Ero ... -Years.htm

It appears you are making misleading claims regarding the influence upon landscapes of erosion (misleading because your article totally ignores tectonic uplift):
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tectonic_uplift.

Also, eroded material is not destroyed but recycled. (Unless you are a magician.)

Van pointed out that the Himalaya are still rising, but your response to simply IGNORES the importance of this and wrongly claims that high altitude fossil bearing rocks should have been eroded away after c 50 million years. If a flood brought the marine fossils there, then yes the fossils should have disappeared with the eroded upper rocks that contained them. But it didn't - and they haven't.

I suggest that it is you who needs to check FACTS. You could start by reading online rebuttals of YEC claims to see whether those claims actually stack up. Have you done so?

RAY: planet Earth is not enclosed in a jar. Is it?"
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Re: FOOTDRAGGING apologist Dr Brown

Postby a_haworthroberts » Tue Oct 08, 2013 1:56 am

Email as just sent to info@askdrbrown.org:

"URGENT QUERY
Dr Brown
Please see my last four or five postings here:
viewtopic.php?f=18&t=2762&start=105
IF MY ATTEMPTED COMMENTS HAVE NOT BEEN MODERATED BY 11 PM UK TIME ON 8 OCTOBER, AND IF I HAVE NOT HEARD BACK FROM YOU (I ALSO USED YOUR WEBSITE CONTACT FORM EARLIER) I WILL PRESUME DISHONEST SILENT CENSORSHIP - AND I WILL EXPOSE THAT BEHAVIOUR. I TRUST THAT WILL NOT BE NECESSARY.
A H-R"
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Re: Devious Dr Sarfati

Postby a_haworthroberts » Tue Oct 08, 2013 5:15 am

Nearly finished listening to the Sarfati marathon. Nothing new so far.

He was pressed about the 1987 sighting of a supernova around 168,000 light years from Earth. His response? Obfuscation and evasion. Followed - when he got a second question - by lies ie that there are 'too few' supernovae for evolutionists as 'explained' in an article on the CMI website (the real truth being that ONE supernova is TOO MANY for YEC-ism).

The liar also accuses Christian Francis Collins of using 'circular reasoning' when he highlights genetic evidence for evolution. Beyond belief.
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Devious anti-evolutionist Dr Michael Brown?

Postby a_haworthroberts » Tue Oct 08, 2013 6:00 am

I have made the following further ATTEMPTED comment at the 2013 Line of Fire thread.

"Dr Brown

I have asked you THREE times why you are failing to moderate my posts - by email, from your website, and on your Facebook page.

You have until 11 pm UK time on 8 October to either approve my posts, fail them, or otherwise reply to my enquiries. Why am I on pre-moderation AT ALL when I have not posted here since 2011, and all my posts were approved THEN? And how come other people's posts ARE appearing when mine are being held back?

IF YOU CHOOSE BLATANT DISHONEST RUDE CENSORSHIP INSTEAD YOUR BEHAVIOUR WILL BE EXPOSED BY EMAIL (I HAVE ON-SCREEN PHOTOS OF MY POSTS) AND AT THE BCSE COMMUNITY FORUM.

If however you behave honestly and fairly, NO such thing will happen.

The choice is yours.

John Heininger and Nicholas Petersen have received emails about your behaviour. They have received photos of my replies to them that YOU appear to wish that they will NOT see.

I have now listened to Sarfati's evasive answers on your programme. He is a clever man for sure.

A H-R"


Have you GOT THAT, Dr Brown?
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Re: Devious creationists

Postby a_haworthroberts » Tue Oct 08, 2013 7:29 am

If there was a creationist dictionary, it would offer the following definition for the word 'refutation' - "deliberate censorship of opposing viewpoints that might show one to be wrong".
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Re:

Postby a_haworthroberts » Tue Oct 08, 2013 10:25 pm

Dr Brown or his colleague has FINALLY approved my posts (earlier today sometime):
http://www.lineoffireradio.com/2013/10/ ... ent-450487
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Re: Devious Dr Sarfati

Postby a_haworthroberts » Sat Oct 12, 2013 11:15 pm

Looks like Dr Sarfati has bowed out of the conversation...
http://www.lineoffireradio.com/2013/10/ ... ent-457065
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Dr Sarfati = Mr Evasion

Postby a_haworthroberts » Sat Oct 26, 2013 8:48 pm

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