a_haworthroberts wrote:Wide circulation email as just sent:
"Young Earth creationists like Sorensen lie in the way that everybody else breathes:
Further proof that these 'Christians' are evil or stupid or insane or full of hate (or ALL of the above). See photos.
Liar Sorensen also claims on his hate facebook page that "Fundie evolutionists do not want reason they want jihad." NO Bob. That would be the evolution-denying psychopathic islamist terrorists. But never let the facts get in the way of propaganda, LIAR Sorensen!
REMEMBER - ALL THIS REPEATED COWARDLY HATE AGAINST MYSELF WAS BECAUSE I ASKED DR JONATHAN SARFATI A QUESTION HE EITHER CANNOT ANSWER OR HE DARE NOT ANSWER. BY BANNING ME INSTEAD OF ADDRESSING MY HIGHLY RELEVANT QUESTION. I SUGGEST HE CHECK-MATED HIMSELF. AND BOB IS ANGRY - AGAIN.
However, I see that after hesitating to for several days. Sarfati has resurfaced at Bob's page and decided to try and DENY science ONCE AGAIN. He now wishes to DISPUTE that this ichthyosaur was attempting to give birth on land. Your evidence that it was NOT, Dr Sarfati? (Ah yes, it must be the opening chapter of Genesis that you are presenting as your 'evidence'. Says the lead scientist of 'Creation Ministries International'.)
Note also that Sarfati fails to quote my actual question (I asked whether he denied that the birth attempt took place on land) and instead pretends - in typical misleading YEC fashion - that I have made some kind of dogmatic statement about the ichthyosaur. Viz his comment to Sorensen:"Why does AH-R think it was giving birth on land?" I only tend towards that view because that is the view of the SCIENTISTS involved. Not because I am trying to 'prove' evolution.
So Jonathan himself now thinks that this (early) ichthyosaur was not in fact attempting to give birth on land and must have been doing so in the sea, despite the fact that one foetus was exiting head first and the abstract of the PLOS One paper states that the scientists think the head-first birth posture is "unlikely to be a breech condition". The scientists also consider that a head-first posture also indicates a "terrestrial origin of viviparity" (live birthing). Sarfati's comments do not directly address much of what the abstract states regarding the would-be head-first birth of this foetus.
http://www.plosone.org/article/info%3Ad ... ne.0088640
But birth of an early ichthyosaur on land would be 'unbiblical' (because they were created as sea creatures not much earlier in time and because they did 'not' evolve from land creatures that themselves had evolved from earlier sea creatures)? The YECs do not appear to have any concrete evidence that this ichthyosaur was actually in the sea and not on land during its failed attempt to give birth. Yet Sarfati now wishes to claim that the unbiblical looking view of the 'secular' scientists 'must' be incorrect.
I would of course agree that the fact that the behaviour of pro-Christian young earth creationists is evil is an UNPLEASANT reality. Especially for other committed Christians who actually think that truth counts for more than dogma and attacks upon scientists.
No wonder Christianity appears to be in decline in the USA. With the internet and improved science education, people can see through the hypocrisy, lies, hate and arrogance of those poor persecuted young earth creationist fundamentalists. The ones who 'debate' people by banning them - and then (in some cases) lying about them and trying to summon up a rabble of whingers to post libellous comments."
PS Minor typos now corrected.
PPS In his article Sarfati did speculate: "the new fossil of a head-first birth may well have been pathological, perhaps the trauma of being buried causing premature birth from the wrong position". A strange occurrence if it happened.
Addendum at 3.45 am on 24 Nov:
I forgot the read Sorensen's new garbage on his facebook page - but didn't miss anything. Here is a taster:
"Another example of bigotry and hate masquerading as "logic" and "reason". This guy has been stalking me for years, and harassing other creationists. The screenshot is from a thread called "Devious Dr. Sarfati", so you know from the outset that he has a strong negative bias against Dr. Sarfati of Creation Ministries International.
Haywire is upset because he picked on an article that CMI posted on FB, left comments, and was banned. But he has a history of obnoxious talk, and has a habit of calling anyone who disagrees with him a "liar". Since he cannot back up his assertion (he tries with making more assertions!), this makes *him* the liar. (By the way, I think he's jealous that my own comments get published at CMI, and he's banned.)
"A fool does not delight in understanding, but only wants to show off his opinions" (Prov. 18:2). Some of us have things to do, and many creationist ministries and individual have banned this guy. Prejudicial conjecture and saying, "No, that's not true because it's not evolution! You're a LIAR!" is not refutation of an argument. Note the either/or fallacies as well as appeal to motive. He doesn't consider the possibility that he was banned because he's an insufferable fool."
I GET BANNED BY YECS BECAUSE I AM NOT A 'FOOL' AND REGULARLY EXPOSE THEIR LIES AND EVASIVENESS. FACT. I AM THREAT TO THEM. MY COMMENTS MUST BE SUPPRESSED AND DEMONISED.
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